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Board » General Discussion » Virtual sailing old ships

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Posted by Capt.D.P. Posts 65 Registered at 2009-10-27 01:51:32	2012-06-16 19:54:16 - Virtual sailing old ships
	I am working on promoting SOL on different other virtual sailing sites but I am often told "what sailing with those square sails boats,forget it. That was before we had this unreasonably sailing with this viking boat. Polars of these boats are really stupid,wander who did them. Sailing strait to the wind with square sails is impossible. Where on earth you should be looking for slower winds to go faster and that is possible with these boats(look at the polars of 3 knts and 6 knts) We IRL sailors can not switch our minds to sail unreasonably. I appreciate the work RC is doing on SOL,but this kind of boats are not what we really want in virtual sailing. Capt. D.P.
Posted by ShamrockPirate Posts 189 Registered at 2010-12-03 17:49:57	2012-06-16 23:58:46 - Re: Virtual sailing old ships
	Variety=Spice And since a good bit of work went into the polars, I am appreciative of the effort. I suspect if all the races were exactly the same, there would be a lot LESS interest. A lowly Pirate opinion.... SP
Posted by K3 (Bernd) Posts 130 Registered at 2008-08-25 12:34:07	2012-06-17 01:16:29 - Re: Virtual sailing old ships
	They row and I like them (because I don't need to row). And they row faster upwind if the wind is weak… Keep up with interesting boats like the dragon or the other squared ones. ciao Bernd (K3)
Posted by 76Trombones Posts 362 Registered at 2009-08-03 18:04:56	2012-06-17 02:02:35 - Re: Virtual sailing old ships
	Heh - Guilty as charged. I've also done the other last couple of dozen added to the SOL fleet . This race has been on the books for almost 3 years so no sense blaming RC . How often do we get a chance to sail longships? I guess we could have used Beneteaus. For the curious, the polar (med roere) is based directly on the work done by the museum at Roskilde on Havhingsten fra Glendalough, an interpretation/replica of the Skuldev 2 find. "Sea Stallion" has done extensive sea trials and several major cruises, and the museum has put a great collection of teaching resources online. Check out the youtube for how wet and miserable halfway across might be. Skål! 76T
Posted by Capt.D.P. Posts 65 Registered at 2009-10-27 01:51:32	2012-06-17 09:24:32 - Re: Virtual sailing old ships
	You must be joking guys,what are we here virtual sailing or virtual rowing. On longship Drake we have than mixed polars for sailing and rowing. This is really for big -L O L- If RC and some of you like to sail that way I would propose that those races are not being ranked and at the same time insert normal sailing boat race which is ranked. We shall than see how many will chose one or other race.
Posted by Alan (iomkiwi) Posts 39 Registered at 2011-11-02 07:13:43	2012-06-17 10:26:26 - Re: Virtual sailing old ships
	I'm only a noob here but I'm going to stick my 'oar' in here As the title of the event says it is a virtual 'raid' - shouldn't we be using the same abilities of the craft in the event we are virtually recreating? As to the polars, aren't they there so that we can see what the boat is cabable of doing in all aspects of performance, and so help us to learn how to sail a variety of boats to their potential? As to the popularity of the event maybe we should compare the number of entries in the 'Raid' to those entered in other recent weekend or weekly ranking events, like the Black Sea races, the Texel races, and the current Haida Gwaii. I say let the variety continue, look at the event then decide whether you want to enter or not, no event is compulsory and missing the occasional event isn't going to harm your ranking that much. Alan
Posted by Rod Posts 350 Registered at 2010-06-24 22:30:48	2012-06-17 13:59:00 - Re: Virtual sailing old ships
	76----My only question about the Longship polar performance is with regards to the upwind performance of a single square sail on a central mast. The sail would most likely have been made of wool, and would have stretched horribly under pressure. Therefore, I wonder if the polar showing almost similar upwind angles and performance to a modern Bermuda style rig is entirely realistic? I realize that it was the Museum that provided the polar info, but.....? As a sidelight on this argument about using historical ships in our races, I would point out that while we (SOL) are unlikely to attract those of the "zoom-zoom, smash 'em-bash 'em" crowd of virtual racers, we are highly likely to attract those who are interested in historical marine activities and the sailing performance of the old sailing vessels, such as the Tea Clippers, and Nelson's "Victory". (Now if we could just add 'wave action', ocean currents, tide and 'sail durability' to our repertoire, including sail blow-outs and sail choice...?) If it breaks, it's not strong enough--if it doesn't, it's too heavy.
Posted by 76Trombones Posts 362 Registered at 2009-08-03 18:04:56	2012-06-17 16:03:20 - Re: Virtual sailing old ships
	A single square sail on a long skinny hull isn't a problem, though the windward performance here isn't spectacular. This is a 30m boat that is making <10m speeds. To be fair, Skuldev 2 is thought to be biased toward rowing performance. Woven wool sails have been shown to perform similarly to hemp and flax. The sheep would have been hair breeds, the sails at least partly fulled, and subjected to smörring to seal and waterproof the surface. Definitely not a fluffy merino sweater.
Posted by NZL_PaulR Posts 311 Registered at 2008-07-22 12:21:30	2012-06-18 08:48:00 - Re: Virtual sailing old ships
	Having a variety of polars IMHO is really great. The rowing aspect adds another dimension of possibilities to consider. If we only raced sloops, with good windward pointing and speed and even thereafter, all races will soon become boring. The challange of sailing in different boats in different parts of the world is one major factor that makes SoL such an interesting event. The historical aspects of the longships and the youtube 4 part Viking Voyages was very interesting and enjoyable. In the past, racing against the tall ships was equally fascinating, especially with live vidcams of the harbour(s) and starts. So a BIG THANKS to all who add aspects to the SoL experience. If it breaks, it's not strong enough!
Posted by AGage Posts 411 Registered at 2008-12-27 10:31:57	2012-06-20 09:57:29 - Re: Virtual sailing old ships
	I cant quite understand why a SINGLE race in the history of Sailonline.org, that used an historic polar including the fact that these boats included rowers is being ragged on... a) Don't sail it... Nothing states we must participate in all races, ergo the SYC ranking being best 10 of last 30 b) +1 to SP's comment, & PaulR's c) Perhaps actually having to examine the polar in a different way is not such a bad thing to begin with... Kind of like how sailing completely different classes IRL makes you a better sailor overall. (Well it has had that effect on my own sailing for sure) Really all SOL did was have a race that took us back in history, and that is the sort of thing that makes virtual sailing so special - that we can actually do that sort of thing... Personally I am pissed I had to miss it due to internet problems, I think its a great idea... Also - I think the place for such comments is in the Race Calendar thread - and BEFORE the race starts. --- Last Edited by Aaron Gage at 2012-06-20 09:58:25 --- I help develop the client interface for the best online ocean racing sim there is... __/)/)_/)__

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