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Posted by NZL_PaulR  |
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Most boats especially IRL need ONE and only one skipper.
Whilst the skipper may invite assistance from crew in decision making, the ultimate responsibility remains the skipper's alone. Many boats with co-skippers do not always succed, and if we look at the around the world races, boats packed with experts often failed to achieve the highest expectations, indeed some crew departed (deserted?) at the next port. Jumping into steer another boat could really destroy one's original plans to move away from a simple course to try and achieve better winds in the future. Getting somebody aground going again, rescuing, is a totally different thing. Another view is that trying to race 20 boats on your own, requires an amazing amount of time, just logging in and checking courses etc. It also requires 20 different plans . . . and eventually one realises that most times there are only three or four options, and . . . eventually you come back to sailing only 3 or 4 boats, with the others being "also rans", just completing the course. --- Last Edited by Paul Rosser at 2011-04-05 03:28:19 --- --- Last Edited by Paul Rosser at 2011-04-05 03:29:15 --- If it breaks, it's not strong enough! |
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Posted by NZL_undercover  |
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I totally agree Paul about wrecking someones plan...........when I assisted Exmeromotu I definitely checked that he had no DC's set otherwise I could be undoing his master plan to sail around us all.
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Posted by Albycore  |
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Hi SOL'rs;
My first introduction to this game was a 1 1/2 day late start in the Bimini Beach run. Worked my way past 40 to 60 boats for various reasons. Oh wow what have I found here. Oh my, SOL is the neatest thing I think I have ever found on the net (IMHO). There were boats going just about every direction, up on the beach, against the wind, backwards, odd tacks, what the? I was instantly a SOL ahololic. IRL I'm a commercial fisherman with some pretty fair navigating skills. The second race I think I entered was the Leg 4 round North Island? I specificly remember a boat doing a 180 loop, someone jumped aboard set it astraight. This is so cool, you can have friends that will fix you up if need be and/or so choose! Then peeking around in the forums I findout I'm competeing against teams with way better sailing skills and knowledge then I!!! I'll show them, oh this is gonna be so fun and educational. I keep hearing talk about teams, software, friends helping friends, SOTP's (still needing very clear & specific defination on this one), people from around the world with various skills ,knowledge , experience, tools, & commoradory (sp)? from all walks of life. Not only are we all competeing against all this, we're having a blast doing it and hopefully doing by personal choice. About half way through Leg 5 of SOL's Global Challenge, I findout how I can use the chart plotter I have owned for a few years! How cool is that? This will a add a new dimension to SOL for me and help me hone my navigating skills (which will hopefully allow me better placing). Mentioning this in chat brought up a conversion. Some feel no extra software should be used. I almost left SOL because I felt I had broken a rule and should be banned (noone mentioned this it was just a personal feeling). I really really like SOL (almost love  )) SOL! Should SOL'rs have to abide by maritime law which requires a helmsman "at all times" when underway? I believe this to be impractical. Though everyone would loose cause I'd be passing all these drifting boats! Leg 6 I didn't have the time and beached twice I choose to run solo, there's just not enough room on this little boat for 2 captains). In this upcoming run for the rum I love the thought of running against the routers, the teams, the non-routers
the SOTP'rs, the friendship boats, the highly skilled, the highly experienced, and the total newbie who may come here knowing nothing, welcome to SOL it's gonna be fun! I do like Paul's idea, and with some of the knowledgeable people around here I wonder if a simple spreadsheet could be made where everyones finish and "class" after the race is then posted in the forum I.D.K. maybe not? In this way you can choose to declare (or choose not to declare) go ahead run in stealth mode class. I'm SOLO run pretty much SOTP I think?, pretty new to SOL, never sailed IRL though I want too REAL bad! I use the chart plotter some 10% maybe, though the SOL client has everything a navigator really needs so I really only get it fired up if I'm gonna be on a long time and feel like it. I also have the butterfly but then again the SOL client polar stares me in the face the whole time so it (the butterfly) doesn't get fired up much either. I own universal plotting sheets, dividers, compass, course protractor, a scientific calc., a book about sailing, and don't use any of that either. I'd do better if I did but wonder if using these tools and knowledge of their use could be cheating or unfair? Once again I believe this to impractical. I just don't use them by choice. I will recommend to anybody wanting to win though that education about the weather, navigation, and sailing is the key. I.D.K just my thoughts on this whole thing but I'd hate to think more rules are needed or tools of the trade and/or knowledge of their use become "illegal". I say run what you brung, declare if you wish, and become the best SOLr out there "I love the challenge" Thanks SOL!!! Wish you all fair winds,just save the rum for me. |
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Posted by AGage  |
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Actually Rod, this isn't quite correct. 'Argumentum ad Absurdum', is when you carry out an argument that leads to a contradiction or absurd/illogical result, therefore showing the original premise to be illogical or absurd - evolving from the phrase 'Reductio ad Absurdum'
What you are referring to is "Argumentum ad Extremus' Edit: spelling corrections. --- Last Edited by Aaron Gage at 2011-04-05 06:40:12 --- I help develop the client interface for the best online ocean racing sim there is... __/)/)_/)__ |
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Posted by AGage |
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LMAO
nice work sir I help develop the client interface for the best online ocean racing sim there is... __/)/)_/)__ |
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Posted by AGage |
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@Albycore: SOTP = Seat Of the Pants, ie no routing software - think of the old time "Flying by the seat of your pants" - no nav instruments... evolved here on SOl from that I think.
But again, the 2 rules: "One boat per person" and "More than 1 person per boat is allowed", almost seem at odds and i cannot for the life of me see how 1 person entering 2 or more boats is an advantage (quite the opposite in fact) other than possibly when faced with a divisive route decision you can take both (or all 3 whatever depending on how many boats you have). If you are racing, AND boatsit, then clearly 1 person has control of 2 boats! It may only be for a small section of the course, but it IS explicity disallowed by the rules. Ergo, "More than 1 person allowed per boat", "Only 1 boat per person" and "Boat-sitting is allowed" are contracdictory, until 'boat-sitting' is given a formal definition - which it should be, and will save much confusion or hard feelings. @UC: yes this time you announced in chat you had altered Exmer's course, but it has been mentioned a few times so far that this has been going on for a while 'behind closed doors', so this is not the first instance, just the first that everyone knows about. Also checking he had no DCs set does not at all guarantee he was not intending to sail where he was. Sometimes it is obvious the boat is off track (ie heading completely wrong direction), but consider my divergence from the fleet in Leg 5 (and assume dunbur was not there so it was just me). I sailed 500+Nm away from the rest of the fleet, which by most definitions is "off track", yet it was entirely deliberate. As I asked before, I would really like to hear from those who wrote the boat-sitting rule explain how they originally envisioned the rule being used. WHY was it included? I help develop the client interface for the best online ocean racing sim there is... __/)/)_/)__ |
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Posted by Schakel |
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Because it cannot be prevented. Theoretically, you could only limit access to any one boat thru IP control, ie. one IP address has access to a boat. But that would block anyone without a fixed IP address, mobile connections, access from work, etc. And still boat sitting would be possible, from the same computer.
Funny thing is, most people don't even get it. The talk about what the rules allow, about helping friends in "danger" (psah, as if sol boats could spring a leak). It's not even about that. It's about getting a fair shot. Otherwise, your "boat" just a stupid blip on a screen going nowhere. Sadly, that ship has sailed here. See ya on the other side. |
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Posted by NZL_undercover |
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@ Schakel:
I have just read your blog. You have miss quoted me. I said "Maybe in the future we will do this behind closed doors if that makes people feel happier..........ignorance is bliss." Nothing about: The “we’ll do it secretly, ignorance is bliss” remark made in the forum made sure of that. The "Maybe" is reasonably import in that statement. What I was trying to point out was that I did do it openly thinking that what I was doing was ok...... In the open in the chat for all to see --- Last Edited by NZL_undercover at 2011-04-05 08:08:10 --- |
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Posted by Schakel |
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Sorry about that, I have corrected it.
Actually, I sort of did it on purpose to kind of not let it get back to you directly but rather to emphasize the point I was making that even if a gentlemen's agreement about the practice of boatsitting, or anything else for that matter, could be made, provided people would want to, there'd always be suspicions, partly due to that particular post. Again sorry, it was not intended as demeaning to your character. Philip --- Last Edited by Schakel at 2011-04-05 09:11:03 --- |
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Posted by AGage |
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@Phillip:
I know that to limit 1 IP per boat is just not practical, nor can any level of cooperation be prevented, my point was/is "In what spirit was boatsitting intended by those who wrote the rule?" 1) To (potentially) allow anyone with your password to login at any time and change your route... 2) To allow agreements be made between SOLers, for those occasions where they cannot control their own boat themselves... 3) We cant stop it so lets make it explicitly allowed.... ???? I also ask this, as this rule "Boatsitting is allowed" is being used to justify other rules which are being broken. Clarification is needed... --- Last Edited by Aaron Gage at 2011-04-05 09:20:17 --- I help develop the client interface for the best online ocean racing sim there is... __/)/)_/)__ |
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Patricks Test
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Marstrand to Cowes 2025
We invite you to another race, which will kick off the third quarter of our ARCH series. We'll set off from Marstrand, Sweden, which, along with Skagen, Denmark, marks the line commonly recognised as the border separating the Baltic Sea from the North Sea. The 650nm route will take our Ripitide 50 across the North Sea and the English Channel to Cowes, England. Watch out for the fast ferries crossing the Channel from Calais to Dover 😊.
Race #1935
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Nantucket Sprint 2025
Welcome to Nantucket, from whence Herman Melville’s Cap’n Ahab sailed round The Horn into the northern Pacific Ocean to hunt the gray whale - whose migrations are celebrated elsewhere in SOL’s Q4 schedule - he never to return. And whaling too, as the 19th C progressed, like Ahab disappeared from Nantucket as the harbour silted up and mainland Massachusetts whaling stations benefited from rail connections. But beach life, yachting and nostalgia has rescued the island from oblivion, so to celebrate leisure, SOL gives you the Nantucket Sprint - 25nm in 29er_XX’s from east of Tuckernuck Island across the sound to a finish just inside the mouth of the harbour. Enjoy!
Race 1936
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Puil's Practice Palaver
Nearly there; only 2500nm to go, round the Horn and up the Red Sea to Suez into what will more than likely be more headwinds for this sixth leg of our African circumnavigation, to be followed in September by a final sneaky dash up the canal back to where we started all those months ago. We’ll be sailing a not entirely appropriate-for-upwind-work 60ft Trimaran!
Race #1859
INFOby brainaid.de
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Gulf of St Lawrence - test - Mirek
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Stefan's Duck Pond
PRIZE: SMPF
Race #1900
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Trapped Camel
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Race starts: Aug 21st 15:03
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Caravanserai
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Patrick's Playpen
Welcome to the legendary "Westcoaster," a race that has tested sailors for over 50 years. Spanning 435 nautical miles, this iconic journey takes racers from Melbourne, across the formidable Bass Strait, and around Tasmania's rugged west coast to the finish line in Hobart. Organized by the Ocean Racing Club of Victoria, the Westcoaster is renowned for its challenging conditions and adventurous spirit. This year, our SOLers will tackle the course in the swift and capable First 47.7, a yacht launched by Beneteau in 2000, built for speed and endurance in long ocean races. Get ready for an exhilarating ride in one of Australia’s most celebrated yacht races!
Race #1841
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Mirek's Mess & Canteen
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Race starts: Apr 26th 18:00
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Antarctica 1 of 3
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Race starts: Jan 27th 21:57
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Flinders Island TIMED Race 2024
Race #1776
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Tasman Double 2023 - Hobart to Sydney
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Race starts: Jan 02nd 02:00
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John's Test Zone
It's time to test your ocean racing skills in a variety of weathers as we head the 6400 NM between Hong Kong and Auckland in a fast Super Maxi 100. We'll be heading from a northern summer to a southern winter so keep plenty of cold weather gear and warm rum on board!
PRIZE: SMPF
Race #1597
INFOby brainaid.de
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calm's Practice Race
Last raced in 2021, we return to Boston for another race to Newport. And just like in 2021, the chosen boat is once again the speedy R/P 66. This is a TIMED race so pick your winds wisely and see how quickly you can complete this 132nm run! For reference, the winning time in 2021 was 6:12:28.
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Race #1700
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ZONA DE PRUEBA DE MANUEL
Please note the displayed course is provisional; the actual course will be set after the IRL course is announced at the skipper's briefing 48 hours before the start, and no later than 24 hours before the start.
Race #1561
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San Sebastian to La Rochelle 2021
Once again, our SOL race will be shared with a group of Polish sailors, representing one of the stages of their Virtual Training Cruise around Europe. 171 nm in Delphia 47s across the not always calm Bay of Biscay from San Sebastian to La Rochelle will undoubtedly be one to test their skills. Welcome/Witajcie and we wish you all fair winds.
Race #1441
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Aland Sea TIMED Race
Norrtalje Segelsallskap, 70km NE of Stockholm was founded in 1920, and time was when the society’s season opened with a challenging offshore race from the club line off Flaten island at the mouth of the long and narrow Norrtaljeviken, out onto a triangular course around the Aland Sea, to finish at Simpnas slightly to the north on Bjorko island - some 78nm in total. A fine race that SOL, being from these parts, ran annually up until 2013. Last run in autumn 2018, we return here to race the course again in the form a TIMED RUN in spanking new Club Swan 50s.
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Race #1444
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Bimmer's Test Zone
What about a speedy X-362 380nm race in the waters off S America, just to blow cobwebs away!!
Race #1415
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Antarctica 3 of 3
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BLANK POLAR
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