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Posted by Rod  |
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Would anyone object if I set up a Consortium of 20 people located strategically around the world, collectively running some 60 boats, using all the routing programs available, and with advance knowledge of the weather, because some will be working at NOAA?
Would anyone object if we set up an elite group of those sailors who were 'entitled' to win races by missing the turn Marks? If the answer is "NO", then I will need to find another hobby. I will await with considerable interest the collective SOL reply. P.S. It is a well recognized technique in philosophical argument to postulate an extreme position---it is called "Argumentum ad absurdum". It does wonders in clarifying muddy arguments. If it breaks, it's not strong enough--if it doesn't, it's too heavy. |
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Posted by ita10267  |
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@Rod
Is your dream team forbidden by the rules? You can't. Is it allowed by the rules? Please do. I (and many others) will have an extreme fun to compete against such a team without whining. And even more fun to beat them consistently. |
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Posted by Rod |
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I do not WANT to set up any such 60 boat consortium---but IF I did, would you ever know it????
If it is 'forbidden' for 60, why should it be 'legal' for 2 ??? The "Rules of the Game"are for everyone. If it breaks, it's not strong enough--if it doesn't, it's too heavy. |
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Posted by ita10267 |
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@Rod.
A Consortium of 60 is not forbidden, nor it is a Consortium of 1000 skipper. What it is clearly forbidden by the rules is, for a single skipper so have more than one boat used for its own advantage. Again, as Kalle has stated, boatsitting is allowed so our discussion here it is meaningless until the rules are changed. Till that moment I will not add any comment to the topic. Over and out. |
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Posted by Tempest  |
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As the rules state "boatsitting "is allowed however
From the FAQ Q: Can me and a friend "share" a boat although we do not share the same computer, or even live in the same country? A: Yes, no problem. Just share your login details and you are all set to share the boat. Only question is - do you trust your friend? Q: Why is it not allowed to have more than one boat? A: We like to give all players a fair chance, multiple boats is considered cheating and therefore not allowed. My question is when becomes "boatsitting" sailing 2 vessels with 2 persons,or 3 vessels with 3 persons which according to the above is at least doubtful behaviour. To my opinion the rules are not very clear in that respect and may need some further clarification. If people are teaming up like that have at least the sportmanship to register one boat as a team and leave the other boats ashore. I am still not a big fan of team boats but can live with it when openly admitted. Hope you don't mind if I stick to single handed sailing. Rescueing other vessels is something else but to compare it to IRL i think is taking it one step to far . Haven't heard any mayday's on the radio lately. To my opinion it can be seen as boatsitting in extremis but I am no fan of it. But if accepted by this community i go with the majority. Tempest |
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Posted by NZL_undercover  |
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My thoughts
Boat sitting is allowed within the rules. I do agree that myself jumping into Exmeromotu's boat the other day with out him asking me too was bending the boat sitting rule........ It was done with no thought to ranking or with no thought to the effect on other sailors. It was done openly as there was nothing to hide. Exmeromotu and Undercover do not run any sort of team boat and openly compete against each other. We do on occasion boat sit for each other as already stated. I also have 2 other sailors that can boat sit for me. I think probably 2-3 times in the last 18 months we have jumped into each others boats in times of need. If the community decide that jumping in is beyond the boat sitting rule then this activity will stop immediately. I don't think either of us have anything to hide and are both honest competitors that really enjoy the SOLing world. Cheers Undercover PS......don't read anything into my boat name |
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Posted by WIN  |
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Rod....
As you have laid on the table "argomentum ad absurdum "  ..and I am fluent in Latin , I feel the duty to contribute my opinion to your queries , and I in bona fide believe that many Solers interprete the rules same way as I do :
1) the rule is "one skipper one boat" ..NOT one boat one skipper " ( quite different ) 2) Syndicates ( consortiums ) have been declared legal by Sailport ( one boat multiple skippers ) 3) boatsitting requires clarification ( agree with AGage ). To me it has always meant : "I will not be able to be at helm from such hour till such hour..please can you keep an eye on my boat to avoid any rocks..?? " When I know that I cannot be at helm at least 90/95% of a race time , then I do not start my boat . 4) Sailport has not declared illegal any software so far. Besides Sailport proposes Sailplanner. Using software or not is personal choice, but I would be extremely favourable to single races for non routers .The fact that some may cheat is rubbish . We are all sportmen and gentlemen ( gentle ladies as well ), and if there is one who is not would be immediatly visible by many means. 5) The shouting for anyone going astray or beaching is controversial . Honestly it is part of my sport experience and culture to beat my competition on the water , and not because their boat has wrecked on the rocks , but still understand those who feel robbed because someone had saved their direct competitor . Honestly I do not think that a personal behaviour of genlemanship with good and bad effects can be subject of any ruling. 6) Since many many moons now the correct rounding of marks has been enforced and the server DOES reject irregular roundings , so NO , you cannot have a team allowed to bypass that rule ...., BUT ...YES ..you can have on board people working for NOAA . In SOL there is no discriminatory rule in that respect . My advice though is that they would know about the weather exactly same time as you do through the gribs . And finally ....Rod ... SURSUM CORDA !!!! (good courage and stay happy !! ) ciao all
WIN |
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Posted by Rod |
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The exact wording of the "One skipper, one boat" and "One boat, one skipper" instruction escapes me at the moment, but somehow I do not find that the two sentences have different meanings. Perhaps this problem need definite clarification.
The Mark turning problem does not apply to the Main races--it occurs only in the informal "practice races" where the computer is not involved. Because of the way in which the computer updates the course lines only at several-minute-intervals, a competitor cannot see whether a Mark has been turned correctly, or not, until several minutes later. There are techniques available whereby a competitor can later view his own (and any other boat's) course at high magnification, and remove all doubt about a correct rounding. If a competitor feels any doubt about whether a Mark was turned correctly, it is easy to check. No penalty has been incurred UNTIL the finish line has been crossed, when the boat either has finished correctly, or is 'Disqualified' for failure to complete the course. In no way has this interfered with either the 'enjoyment' or the 'practice' of these 'practice races'. It only determines whether the competitor can validly claim a "WIN" or a "Position" in the finishing order. If it breaks, it's not strong enough--if it doesn't, it's too heavy. |
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Posted by 76Trombones  |
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Clamo, clamatis, omnes clamamus pro glace lactis
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Posted by NZL_PaulR  |
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Perhaps when entering a race, one should declare wether they are using "routing software" or not.
Just like IRL entering a spinnaker or non-spinnaker division of a race. The results leaderboard could show this. Will people cheat or wrongly declare? Possibly but then again most of us all sail IRL and for me I would not. Just like using your motor if it is calm!! Previously I have stated, SOL is a great place to learn "HOW" to use routing software. I have used the Sail Planner, but currently do not use any routing software; relying entitrely on SOTP v5.9. (Seat of the Pants) If it breaks, it's not strong enough! |
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Patricks Test
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Marstrand to Cowes 2025
We invite you to another race, which will kick off the third quarter of our ARCH series. We'll set off from Marstrand, Sweden, which, along with Skagen, Denmark, marks the line commonly recognised as the border separating the Baltic Sea from the North Sea. The 650nm route will take our Ripitide 50 across the North Sea and the English Channel to Cowes, England. Watch out for the fast ferries crossing the Channel from Calais to Dover 😊.
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Nantucket Sprint 2025
Welcome to Nantucket, from whence Herman Melville’s Cap’n Ahab sailed round The Horn into the northern Pacific Ocean to hunt the gray whale - whose migrations are celebrated elsewhere in SOL’s Q4 schedule - he never to return. And whaling too, as the 19th C progressed, like Ahab disappeared from Nantucket as the harbour silted up and mainland Massachusetts whaling stations benefited from rail connections. But beach life, yachting and nostalgia has rescued the island from oblivion, so to celebrate leisure, SOL gives you the Nantucket Sprint - 25nm in 29er_XX’s from east of Tuckernuck Island across the sound to a finish just inside the mouth of the harbour. Enjoy!
Race 1936
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Puil's Practice Palaver
Nearly there; only 2500nm to go, round the Horn and up the Red Sea to Suez into what will more than likely be more headwinds for this sixth leg of our African circumnavigation, to be followed in September by a final sneaky dash up the canal back to where we started all those months ago. We’ll be sailing a not entirely appropriate-for-upwind-work 60ft Trimaran!
Race #1859
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Gulf of St Lawrence - test - Mirek
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Stefan's Duck Pond
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Race #1900
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Trapped Camel
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Caravanserai
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Patrick's Playpen
Welcome to the legendary "Westcoaster," a race that has tested sailors for over 50 years. Spanning 435 nautical miles, this iconic journey takes racers from Melbourne, across the formidable Bass Strait, and around Tasmania's rugged west coast to the finish line in Hobart. Organized by the Ocean Racing Club of Victoria, the Westcoaster is renowned for its challenging conditions and adventurous spirit. This year, our SOLers will tackle the course in the swift and capable First 47.7, a yacht launched by Beneteau in 2000, built for speed and endurance in long ocean races. Get ready for an exhilarating ride in one of Australia’s most celebrated yacht races!
Race #1841
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Mirek's Mess & Canteen
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Antarctica 1 of 3
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Flinders Island TIMED Race 2024
Race #1776
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Tasman Double 2023 - Hobart to Sydney
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Race starts: Jan 02nd 02:00
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John's Test Zone
It's time to test your ocean racing skills in a variety of weathers as we head the 6400 NM between Hong Kong and Auckland in a fast Super Maxi 100. We'll be heading from a northern summer to a southern winter so keep plenty of cold weather gear and warm rum on board!
PRIZE: SMPF
Race #1597
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calm's Practice Race
Last raced in 2021, we return to Boston for another race to Newport. And just like in 2021, the chosen boat is once again the speedy R/P 66. This is a TIMED race so pick your winds wisely and see how quickly you can complete this 132nm run! For reference, the winning time in 2021 was 6:12:28.
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Race #1700
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ZONA DE PRUEBA DE MANUEL
Please note the displayed course is provisional; the actual course will be set after the IRL course is announced at the skipper's briefing 48 hours before the start, and no later than 24 hours before the start.
Race #1561
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San Sebastian to La Rochelle 2021
Once again, our SOL race will be shared with a group of Polish sailors, representing one of the stages of their Virtual Training Cruise around Europe. 171 nm in Delphia 47s across the not always calm Bay of Biscay from San Sebastian to La Rochelle will undoubtedly be one to test their skills. Welcome/Witajcie and we wish you all fair winds.
Race #1441
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Aland Sea TIMED Race
Norrtalje Segelsallskap, 70km NE of Stockholm was founded in 1920, and time was when the society’s season opened with a challenging offshore race from the club line off Flaten island at the mouth of the long and narrow Norrtaljeviken, out onto a triangular course around the Aland Sea, to finish at Simpnas slightly to the north on Bjorko island - some 78nm in total. A fine race that SOL, being from these parts, ran annually up until 2013. Last run in autumn 2018, we return here to race the course again in the form a TIMED RUN in spanking new Club Swan 50s.
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Race #1444
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Bimmer's Test Zone
What about a speedy X-362 380nm race in the waters off S America, just to blow cobwebs away!!
Race #1415
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Antarctica 3 of 3
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BLANK POLAR
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