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Posted by Hirilondë |
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I just logged into the Inhaca RTI Sprint to set up my morning back up DC for the start and noticed the polars for the present wind. I am in 15.6 kts. wind and the optimum TWA to weather is 34º? Unless they have done some drastic changes to the class I don't recall a Mini ever being able to sail much better than 45º TWA. In 2005 Rodney Johnstone's proto design was built for the 2007 Mini Transat. It was probably the most weatherly proto built and could just get to 45º TWA These are reaching boats designed specifically for the route from France to Brazil.
Anyway, I suggest checking into this. Probably too late for this race, but 34º is unrealistic to keep. |
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Posted by kroppyer ![]() |
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Hi Hirilonde,
We are aware that the mini 6.50 polar is not as realistic as can be in multiple ways. Partially because you pointed it out 2 years ago here. We try to be as realistic as we can (without getting wet), and there's a lot of places where we can improve. In the case of designing polars and updating them, we try to take the guesswork out of it more and more. We try our best to get reliable data to create a good polar. I'm not sure how the mini polar came to be. If we were to update the polar, my opinion would be that it has to be based on good data. In the absence of that data, there will be no update. Personally, I really like the mini 650 polar sol has. It might not be worthy of carrying the name "mini 6.5" because it doesn't represent the performance of a mini well enough, but it's a challenging polar that I enjoy very much. If this mismatch between polar and reality is a real issue, renaming the polar might be a solution. But apart from that, it would of course be nice to have a good, realistic mini 6.5 polar on sol. We need data for that (at least 40 points of high quality, if points are less reliable we need lots more points. The OD60v3 polar was designed using several thousands of datapoints). --- Last Edited by kroppyer at 2015-11-14 23:42:52 --- |
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Posted by Hirilondë |
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Thanks for the reply, again
![]() The Mini is a box rule, so there is no one polar and I have no data on any boat myself. I would think that rounding out the curve to weather to be a little more like a multi-hull would make SOL's polar at least a good bit closer to real. I am not so concerned about being an actual reflection, but the performance of this polar is just plain weird. In the mid range winds it is almost as if the boat had 2 head sails creating a dip in the curve. And I have never seen the dip of any polar at 40º TWA. Thanks for listening........... |
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Posted by Yohann Voileur ![]() |
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Hi Guys,
While Qt crunches here's two further thoughts on the matter. 1/ two headsails is exactly how I always interpreted this polar, which has the merit of keeping you busy. 1a/ two downwind sails (a gennaker and an oversized symmetrical) also seems to be part of the wardrobe, for more HOT (hand on the tiller) sailing. 2/ there is a source against which we can compare our data. VR are running the Mini Transat at the moment and their polars are available on http://gwranking.forumactif.org/h10-outils-pour-vrtool. I'll do a comparison and report back. Clipping along |
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Posted by Hirilondë |
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Last I knew all a Mini had was a working jib, code 0, large and small spinnaker.
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Posted by JB ![]() |
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From: http://minitransat650.com/leov/html/design.html
"*Sails : The number of approved sails carried on board must not exceed eight (8). This must include a storm jib of maximum area 4m2, reef able to 2.5m2, and a try sail of 5m2 maximum area of a fluorescent colour and a minimum weight of 340 g/m2. * Material Sails (EXPECT BIG CHANGE IN 2008 RULES) * Mainsail : woven polyester, with windows of 0.2m2 maximum area.* Head sail : woven polyester and polyester film * (Head sails in 3DL are permitted but only in polyester -this was a ruling made in February 1997)* Spinnaker : nylon *Double film sails count as 2 sails. A wing mast of more than 2m2 in projected area counts as one sail, as well as any other wind propulsion system. See article I-11 for the sail number rule." Fair winds to all. |
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Posted by Rod |
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Do you intend that we will have a choice of sails? --- And if we guess wrong, the sail will blow-out and be lost forever?
Yours for greater realism!!!!!! Rod If it breaks, it's not strong enough--if it doesn't, it's too heavy. |
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Posted by JB ![]() |
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Viva Rod.
Yes you can choose your sails for the race but, inside the actual J-23 paragraph Sail Rules (2015_-_OFFICIAL_TEXTS_-_MINI_RULES_(J_AND_S).pdf). If you made a bad sail/material choice and/or blew it under way, that’s it, you have to conform to it. Fair winds to all. |
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Posted by JB ![]() |
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Have also a look on:
argo 650 ficha.pdf , about the number and type of sails for the mini 6.50 class. Fair winds to all. |
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Marstrand to Cowes 2025

We invite you to another race, which will kick off the third quarter of our ARCH series. We'll set off from Marstrand, Sweden, which, along with Skagen, Denmark, marks the line commonly recognised as the border separating the Baltic Sea from the North Sea. The 650nm route will take our Ripitide 50 across the North Sea and the English Channel to Cowes, England. Watch out for the fast ferries crossing the Channel from Calais to Dover 😊.
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Nantucket Sprint 2025

Welcome to Nantucket, from whence Herman Melville’s Cap’n Ahab sailed round The Horn into the northern Pacific Ocean to hunt the gray whale - whose migrations are celebrated elsewhere in SOL’s Q4 schedule - he never to return. And whaling too, as the 19th C progressed, like Ahab disappeared from Nantucket as the harbour silted up and mainland Massachusetts whaling stations benefited from rail connections. But beach life, yachting and nostalgia has rescued the island from oblivion, so to celebrate leisure, SOL gives you the Nantucket Sprint - 25nm in 29er_XX’s from east of Tuckernuck Island across the sound to a finish just inside the mouth of the harbour. Enjoy!
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Nearly there; only 2500nm to go, round the Horn and up the Red Sea to Suez into what will more than likely be more headwinds for this sixth leg of our African circumnavigation, to be followed in September by a final sneaky dash up the canal back to where we started all those months ago. We’ll be sailing a not entirely appropriate-for-upwind-work 60ft Trimaran!
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Stefan's Duck Pond

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Trapped Camel
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Caravanserai
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Patrick's Playpen

Welcome to the legendary "Westcoaster," a race that has tested sailors for over 50 years. Spanning 435 nautical miles, this iconic journey takes racers from Melbourne, across the formidable Bass Strait, and around Tasmania's rugged west coast to the finish line in Hobart. Organized by the Ocean Racing Club of Victoria, the Westcoaster is renowned for its challenging conditions and adventurous spirit. This year, our SOLers will tackle the course in the swift and capable First 47.7, a yacht launched by Beneteau in 2000, built for speed and endurance in long ocean races. Get ready for an exhilarating ride in one of Australia’s most celebrated yacht races!
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Antarctica 1 of 3
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Flinders Island TIMED Race 2024

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Tasman Double 2023 - Hobart to Sydney
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John's Test Zone
It's time to test your ocean racing skills in a variety of weathers as we head the 6400 NM between Hong Kong and Auckland in a fast Super Maxi 100. We'll be heading from a northern summer to a southern winter so keep plenty of cold weather gear and warm rum on board!
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calm's Practice Race
Last raced in 2021, we return to Boston for another race to Newport. And just like in 2021, the chosen boat is once again the speedy R/P 66. This is a TIMED race so pick your winds wisely and see how quickly you can complete this 132nm run! For reference, the winning time in 2021 was 6:12:28.
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ZONA DE PRUEBA DE MANUEL

Please note the displayed course is provisional; the actual course will be set after the IRL course is announced at the skipper's briefing 48 hours before the start, and no later than 24 hours before the start.
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Aland Sea TIMED Race
Norrtalje Segelsallskap, 70km NE of Stockholm was founded in 1920, and time was when the society’s season opened with a challenging offshore race from the club line off Flaten island at the mouth of the long and narrow Norrtaljeviken, out onto a triangular course around the Aland Sea, to finish at Simpnas slightly to the north on Bjorko island - some 78nm in total. A fine race that SOL, being from these parts, ran annually up until 2013. Last run in autumn 2018, we return here to race the course again in the form a TIMED RUN in spanking new Club Swan 50s.
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What about a speedy X-362 380nm race in the waters off S America, just to blow cobwebs away!!
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Antarctica 3 of 3
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BLANK POLAR
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