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Posted by Yohann Voileur  |
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Just read Roland Stoerte's report on the B2B2 of last night. As he wrote it was all about 'rounding' and a minor tactical decision for the close-hauled bit to the finish: pinch or put in a tack. Roland writes about 'counting' to know when to press 'send command'. How does that work, anybody?
During my short SOL career I have developed a quite different approach to the dilemma of 'timing'. I found a few VBA UDF's on the net which return course and distance between two lats and lons. So I enter the relevant lats and lons into a spreadsheet before a race (or as I go along) and then copy and paste time of day, speed and position over from BrainAid (ever more frequently) as I close on a buoy or a cape or a shore. If BrainAid's data is fully synced, then my spreadsheet returns me my exact ETA to the next manoeuvre, except of course that speed may change as I progress and that I may be on a TWA curve and not a COG straight line. Editing the pre-set DC then completes the process and with 30 secs to go I just sit back and wait. It continues to surprise how much the calc'd ETA varies from one sample to the next. Even with just two or thee minutes to the mark and no noticeable speed variation (e.g as a result of performance recovery perhaps) the swings are often order of mag 5 to 10 secs. An element of luck and a trade-off risk v reward thus remains. So... does BrainAid provide a wholly accurate sync'd sample of a SOL yacht's data, or... ? Thoughts anybody? Clipping along |
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Posted by kroppyer  |
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SOL's normal client updates your own boat position every 15 seconds, and requests its data directly from sailonline.
brainaid's navigation page updates boat data roughly every 10 seconds, and requests its data from brainaid.de (which probably gets its data, without caching, from sailonline). Sailonline recalculates the position of your boat with a variable interval. My experience is that this interval is usually 10 seconds. This means that, using sol's client, you will see your boat move every 15 seconds (maybe in a rare case, 30 seconds). If you see you have only one jump left to the mark, you can count to 10, and then turn, assuming the server already jumped, but before the client updates. This can go wrong. Sometimes I get the feeling that commands are executed in-between two jumps (boat turns less than a single jump-length from my last position). Sometimes, even after 10 seconds, my boat turns at its last position, 5 seconds later the client updates and shows a track that suggests my boat turned 10 seconds earlier than I sent the command. If you set a good DC, with some margin (and do not adjust it using the DC countdown, unless you are sure your local clock is in sync with sailonline), your boat often does a good rounding. For now, I think the best method is: set a reasonably safe DC (like 10 seconds after the mark), then try to beat that manually, using your preferred method (counting, instinct, visual, confidence, praying, persuasion of sol server, telekinesis). Turning you boat at an exact place is hard, and I think part of a good rounding is not only getting your boat to turn where you want it to turn, but also accepting that you can't do that, and solving it differently: leave some room to the mark (or land), turn about one jump before you're at the mark so that you touch the mark (this needs practise). You will sail past the mark with a better angle: the distance you travel after the mark is not as much in the wrong direction as usual. When you can, of course, complete the turn. 
This is how accurate DC roundings can be:  --- Last Edited by kroppyer at 2014-05-04 20:11:18 --- |
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Posted by JB  |
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Viva Jan and Kroopy.
Not long ago in this forum I’ve put some words about my frustration precisely about this issue. So, I’m totally in tune with both. My conclusions were/are simple. Instead of a precise boat maneuver, trying to turn where you need and want, it’s an act of pure luck and/or faith. For the same “sail engine” input conditions (TWD/TWA/TWS) the same boat has, sometimes, makes different consecutive jump lengths and, even in the same run, different ones. So, I discovered also that my boat has free will, challenging logic, laws of kinematics, accuracy and, in last ratio, the patient of the sailor. In long races, unless you are close to a competitor, it doesn’t make a big difference or, any at all. In TR’s, where go “cutting the corners”, it can result in loss of several places. Yes, we have to accept that “luck” is part of the sport, but it shouldn’t be here applicable. There are two (cumulative, or not) solutions for this problem: 1 - Effective DC’s - function of remaining distance and B.S., the boat changes direction in the precise calculated time, as it should be; 2 - Waypoints - the boat changes direction on previously defined marks, independently of all the prevailing conditions. The same lack of accuracy can be pointed to the famous “jumps over land”. I was in shock when it happened to me. Again, it shouldn’t. Big Hug from João Fair winds to all. |
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Posted by Rod  |
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The above entries describe very closely my own experience and complaints about the precise point and time at which course changes are executed. I also have not,(so far?) been able to determine any "formula" which describes the process.
My question here, as a "non-user-of-routers", and observing the superior performance of those who do use them, is whether these routers have SOLVED this problem. Am I merely penalizing myself and my SOLing performance by refraining from their use, just to keep tuned the "old grey cells"? If it breaks, it's not strong enough--if it doesn't, it's too heavy. |
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Posted by kroppyer |
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Rod,
Most* routers are useless in these short races. To speed up the routing process they use "jumps" of much more than 10 or 15 seconds. So they certainly do not help you rounding marks (or at least, not when you can't lose a few minutes). *) I say "most" because I can't pretend to know "all" routers. Maybe there is a router, specifically made for online sailing, that is able to use very small jumps. |
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Posted by Rod |
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I will continue to exercise the "old grey cells"---in the vague hope that they will become "young" grey cells----if I could just remember 'how' to do it...... --- Last Edited by Rod at 2014-06-27 16:28:18 --- If it breaks, it's not strong enough--if it doesn't, it's too heavy. |
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Marstrand to Cowes 2025
We invite you to another race, which will kick off the third quarter of our ARCH series. We'll set off from Marstrand, Sweden, which, along with Skagen, Denmark, marks the line commonly recognised as the border separating the Baltic Sea from the North Sea. The 650nm route will take our Ripitide 50 across the North Sea and the English Channel to Cowes, England. Watch out for the fast ferries crossing the Channel from Calais to Dover 😊.
Race #1935
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Nantucket Sprint 2025
Welcome to Nantucket, from whence Herman Melville’s Cap’n Ahab sailed round The Horn into the northern Pacific Ocean to hunt the gray whale - whose migrations are celebrated elsewhere in SOL’s Q4 schedule - he never to return. And whaling too, as the 19th C progressed, like Ahab disappeared from Nantucket as the harbour silted up and mainland Massachusetts whaling stations benefited from rail connections. But beach life, yachting and nostalgia has rescued the island from oblivion, so to celebrate leisure, SOL gives you the Nantucket Sprint - 25nm in 29er_XX’s from east of Tuckernuck Island across the sound to a finish just inside the mouth of the harbour. Enjoy!
Race 1936
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Puil's Practice Palaver
Nearly there; only 2500nm to go, round the Horn and up the Red Sea to Suez into what will more than likely be more headwinds for this sixth leg of our African circumnavigation, to be followed in September by a final sneaky dash up the canal back to where we started all those months ago. We’ll be sailing a not entirely appropriate-for-upwind-work 60ft Trimaran!
Race #1859
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Gulf of St Lawrence - test - Mirek
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Stefan's Duck Pond
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Race #1900
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Trapped Camel
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Caravanserai
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Patrick's Playpen
Welcome to the legendary "Westcoaster," a race that has tested sailors for over 50 years. Spanning 435 nautical miles, this iconic journey takes racers from Melbourne, across the formidable Bass Strait, and around Tasmania's rugged west coast to the finish line in Hobart. Organized by the Ocean Racing Club of Victoria, the Westcoaster is renowned for its challenging conditions and adventurous spirit. This year, our SOLers will tackle the course in the swift and capable First 47.7, a yacht launched by Beneteau in 2000, built for speed and endurance in long ocean races. Get ready for an exhilarating ride in one of Australia’s most celebrated yacht races!
Race #1841
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Mirek's Mess & Canteen
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Antarctica 1 of 3
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Flinders Island TIMED Race 2024
Race #1776
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Tasman Double 2023 - Hobart to Sydney
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Race starts: Jan 02nd 02:00
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John's Test Zone
It's time to test your ocean racing skills in a variety of weathers as we head the 6400 NM between Hong Kong and Auckland in a fast Super Maxi 100. We'll be heading from a northern summer to a southern winter so keep plenty of cold weather gear and warm rum on board!
PRIZE: SMPF
Race #1597
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calm's Practice Race
Last raced in 2021, we return to Boston for another race to Newport. And just like in 2021, the chosen boat is once again the speedy R/P 66. This is a TIMED race so pick your winds wisely and see how quickly you can complete this 132nm run! For reference, the winning time in 2021 was 6:12:28.
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ZONA DE PRUEBA DE MANUEL
Please note the displayed course is provisional; the actual course will be set after the IRL course is announced at the skipper's briefing 48 hours before the start, and no later than 24 hours before the start.
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San Sebastian to La Rochelle 2021
Once again, our SOL race will be shared with a group of Polish sailors, representing one of the stages of their Virtual Training Cruise around Europe. 171 nm in Delphia 47s across the not always calm Bay of Biscay from San Sebastian to La Rochelle will undoubtedly be one to test their skills. Welcome/Witajcie and we wish you all fair winds.
Race #1441
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Aland Sea TIMED Race
Norrtalje Segelsallskap, 70km NE of Stockholm was founded in 1920, and time was when the society’s season opened with a challenging offshore race from the club line off Flaten island at the mouth of the long and narrow Norrtaljeviken, out onto a triangular course around the Aland Sea, to finish at Simpnas slightly to the north on Bjorko island - some 78nm in total. A fine race that SOL, being from these parts, ran annually up until 2013. Last run in autumn 2018, we return here to race the course again in the form a TIMED RUN in spanking new Club Swan 50s.
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Race #1444
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Bimmer's Test Zone
What about a speedy X-362 380nm race in the waters off S America, just to blow cobwebs away!!
Race #1415
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Antarctica 3 of 3
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BLANK POLAR
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